Conspiracy...

A place to talk

Moderator: Moderators

Conspiracy...

Postby Joehtosis on Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:12 am

I'll go ahead and put up this thread, just for those of us that like to dabble in the paranormal, the unexplainable, or the plainly hilarious conspiracy theories out there. Feel free to discuss whatever one you've wished to talk about. I'll post the one I've been itching to get some feed-back with now. :]
_____________________________________________
Alright, as of the last couple years, I've been quite interested in conspiracy theories. Most I dismiss, and only one so far has actually garnered respect from me. (Well done, Alex Jones.)

However, this one just disturbs me to no end. There's evidence for it.. There's evidence against it.. But mostly the people who believe it are crazed loons shouting the return of our reptilian creator over-lords. I found it long ago and I dismissed it simply because the people portraying it made all respect for the topic fall to shambles. However, recently, while browsing around, looking for something interesting to read, I came across it again, and this time it wasn't a bunch of foaming loons preaching alien creationism, it was actual coherent people! :o

Anyway, back on topic. To quickly sum things up, supposedly there is a 10th marginally large planet (about four times larger than Earth) in our solar neighborhood, and it's orbit is extremely elliptical and large, taking approximately 3,600 years to make one orbit. Supposedly this said planet is on it's way, 2012 (oh my, coincidence?) and there may be some chaotic messes to deal with on it's return.

So, say one was to believe this, there must be evidence, and here's the main gist. In the last couple centuries, astronomers have been studying the orbits of our planets and they time and again have discovered irregularities in their orbits. They discovered first Uranus, then Neptune, then Pluto by looking for the culprit of these orbital irregularities. However, the irregularity is STILL there, with Pluto. If one were to follow the pattern, there must be another large planet, or other, out there.

So, they've still been at it, diligently exploring the sky, and they've discovered many things. They've discovered the Kuiper belt and many various dwarf planets. I'm willing to simply drop the subject and say that those are the culprits of Pluto's irregularities, but as far as I know, no one has done the math, or the estimated mass of these objects is not enough to cause the irregularity shown within Pluto's orbit.

All that I have stated has so far, been fact. Now we move on to the "evidence" suggested by the theorists. I put it in quotes because I don't believe evidence is a hypothesis driven up by a man, it's a hypothesis, nothing wrong with it, I just wish they'd stop trying to pass it off as actual fact.

ANYWAY. Supposedly, back in 1983 a satellite telescope known as IRAS discovered the object, planet X. The theorists push the notion that this is true, and that NASA, due to interest of keeping the public calm, has hidden their discoveries. However, I looked into this, and it seems NASA did discover objects that it thought were planets, however, these turned out to be galaxies and other objects. So there goes that.

So considering all this, there is a genuine basis of scientific proof of something that's there... And then there's also the trolls looking for a laugh, putting up false evidence, and the others who are so desperate to believe this. So basically, it's a MAYBE. A very strong MAYBE.

That's all well and good, what disturbs me is, what happens if it's real? Supposedly, this thing could be 1 of three things. A large rocky planet or asteroid, a comet, or a red dwarf. If it's a rocky planet or comet, then the chaos to come would probably be minimal. What would make things horrible is if it's a red dwarf. Assuming this is true, if it swings into our realm of the solar system, the solar disturbances and storms that would drift out into space would simply bombard the surrounding planets, and virtually cook the said planet with radiation and other levels of energy. This could range from electric disturbances and world wide black outs, to a slaughter of Earth's life, cooking the planet like a microwave. Whatever magnetic protections we have that could protect from this would be over-whelmed and little hope would remain for us... (I love how in my mind I'm imagining it as a swarm of Tyranids devastating a legion of Imperials.)

Now, to come back from fairy tale doomsday world, I have trouble believing it could possibly get to epic proportions of world-wide extinction of all life. Why? Well, quite simply, logic tells one, if this thing is in orbit, it's visited us before, and we're still here. I do believe that it may have the power to disturb our technologies however and that in itself could bring about many problems all on it's own, but global extinction is ridiculous... If it visits every couple thousand year, I'm quite certain we'll be fine if we've survived thus far.

So, assuming it has visited us before, let's move back to the last time it supposedly came into our solar district. A man known as Zecharia Sitchin, who apparently is able to decipher ancient Sumerian tablets, spent some time with his skills and came up with this as a translation... The Sumerians were an astrologically gifted people. They had extensive knowledge of the stars and planets... Even planets that existed before life itself. Such as Tiamat and Nibiru (which is perhaps Planet X). So how the hell did they discover this knowledge? Oh, that's obvious! We were visited by Anunnaki! Our great alien creators! I hope by now you can detect my sarcasm. But in all seriousness, this is the story. Supposedly on Nibiru, the Anunnaki reside and a story goes on that's just sickeningly similar to the story of the Masari from Universe at War. They come down to our planet, their "home away from home" on a mission, and need a genetic slave. They pick up our ancestors, homo erectus, and supposedly genetically engineer US from DNA from our ancestors and their own genetic make up.

Now, let's slow down, and look at this intelligently. First off, Nibiru, if it exists, sends it's self out farther than pluto, well beyond the grace of our star's light and heat. How could life, as we know it, possibly ever develop in such a realm? Perhaps if it has substantial amounts of water and volcanic vents deep under it's oceans, then MAYBE, life could develop, but I doubt it would be anything beyond the level of coral, crabs, worms, or primitive fish. A being that just COINCIDENTALLY has similar make-up to us (I'm extremely skeptical any aliens we ever encounter will look or function anything like us), walks up-right, has reptilian features, or looks like your stereo-typical "gray" alien, could not exist or function properly in such an environment.

Buuuuuuttt.... You can't deny what's on the tablets. If what the man says is true, it's amazing the Sumerians just MADE up what they put on those tablets. A sun with an accurate number of planets... Even devising the idea of genetic engineering surprises me... But what disturbs me the most is that on some, one could make out a double helix that are made of snakes. I just can't help but think.. "What is this? I don't even... "

Then again... The ancient Greeks almost reached a level of technology that permitted automated structures so I know one shouldn't underestimate the powers of our imagination.

So all this information simply leaves me to a point where I just can't make a decision. Is it out there? Maybe. If it's not? Fine. If it is? A lot of us who aren't prepared are going to die. I'm thinking about maybe saving up to just buy a lot of canned food.. I mean if I'm wrong, I can always save on food for later and eat my investment lol.

I'm interested in what others have to think on this though and I'd like to see others opinions. It's a deep subject, involves space (always fun!) and has a lot of wacky twists and turns lol. (REPTILIAN OVERLORDS!)

But please, I know it's a controversial subject, don't call anyone an idiot or stupid for simply trying to get some answers here, or call anyone an unholy infidel for not believing in the All Powerful Anunnaki. :lol:

For those that would like to read up on the subject more, I'll give some of the sources from both sides of the arguments I found:
Pro-side:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8S0bj76389U (Watch all 4 parts. The last one hardly matters.)
http://www.crystalinks.com/nibiru.html
http://xfacts.com/x.htm#
Con-side:
http://astrobiology.nasa.gov/ask-an-ast ... nd-answers
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nibiru_collision
http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/index.html
Last edited by Joehtosis on Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:57 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Nothing in the world is impossible.
Get up, what you slowin' down for?
User avatar
Joehtosis
Genestealer
 
Posts: 151
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:57 am
Location: Delaware

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Son_of_Foamy on Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:04 am

tl;dr

...ok, I read some of it. So in summary, there's supposedly a 10th planet out there that might/might not collide with our planet or maybe perhaps, possibly mess with us in some form or fashion. Sorta.

...I'm going to need to see this article or the evidence thereof for myself before I give my real opinion.
Current S_o_F Mood: Feelin' Strangely Fine

Chief follower of the Church of the Lord's Pantaloons
"And 'lo, she did kneel and gaze upon the Lord, and He did grace her with his favour'
User avatar
Son_of_Foamy
Mod Team
Mod Team
 
Posts: 133
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:34 pm
Location: My Head, Brisbane, Australia

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Zaha on Wed Jul 01, 2009 11:25 am

*raises hand*

I assume you've moved the "Planet X" you're referring to out a few orbital rings from Pluto since the inclusion of Haumea, Makemake and Eris as the outermost dwarf planets in our Solar System?

Also, I assume you're aware that a Red Giant couldn't feasibly orbit Ol' Sol and pass through the planetary orbits without (a) destroying every planet in the Solar System the first time it passed through and (b) either falling into or swallowing up the Sun because Red Giants vary in size from half that of the Sun to 10 times that of the Sun? The only way a Red Giant could orbit the Sun without both of the above happening is if it orbited it from REALLY far away.

Within the realms of probability though, there are rumours of a planetoid on an extreme elliptical orbit that could cause such orbital disruptions. There are a few very good historical reasons to suggest that the Earth might have once held a different orbit; we've unearthed a very old Egyptian calendar which had a much shorter year (so much so that it would only take a decade for the seasons to be completely inverted from actual fact), and given their agrarian society and reliance on seasons (not to mention astronomical acumen) it would seem impossible for them to make so horrific a mistake unless that actually WAS the yearly cycle of the time (unless they were suffering a mad Pharaoh's decree scenario lasting about a century and across multiple rulers). Likewise, there are records of incidents of "naphtha" (in the original sense, not in the current scientific sense) falling from the sky which could easily be explained by such astral bodies passing near Earth's atmosphere (again, seems unlikely to have a lot of accounts of fire falling from the sky unless it did actually happen at least once).

However, such a planetoid would have almost no hope of hosting any form of life higher than bacteria because planetary internal heat (which is required for your thermal vent theory) relies heavily on proximity to the Sun or extreme pressure from gravitic stresses (as is the case with the gas giants); the energy burns out very quickly if there isn't more energy pumping into the planet's ecosystem from outside.

Also, I would argue that conflating Tiamat into a planet would be a very bad mistake.
I am the Border of Kaleidoscopic Logic
User avatar
Zaha
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:20 am

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Old-one-eye on Wed Jul 01, 2009 2:51 pm

Well... The end of the world is the 21st of December, 2012 according to the Mayan calendar :P
I have many names that only the wind and trees can say. I am the mountain, the forest and the earth.
User avatar
Old-one-eye
Ravener
 
Posts: 574
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:45 pm
Location: In a labyrinth somewhere in northern Spain waiting for princess Moanna...

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Zaha on Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:17 pm

Incorrect.

The end of the current calendar cycle is the 21st of December, 2012.

There's a difference.
I am the Border of Kaleidoscopic Logic
User avatar
Zaha
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:20 am

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Joey625 on Wed Jul 01, 2009 4:52 pm

i really dont believe that stuff lol but the movie coming out 2012 looks really good and its all about that :P
My Dawn of War username is Joey62591 if anyone wants to hit me up for a game
Joey625
Broodlord
 
Posts: 266
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:52 am
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Joehtosis on Wed Jul 01, 2009 8:41 pm

Alright well, first, son_of_foamy:
No I don't think it's going to collide with us. As I stated in mah rather large post (Sorry about that)
Well, quite simply, logic tells one, if this thing is in orbit, it's visited us before, and we're still here. I do believe that it may have the power to disturb our technologies however and that in itself could bring about many problems all on it's own, but global extinction is ridiculous... If it visits every couple thousand year, I'm quite certain we'll be fine if we've survived thus far.

Zaha:
See, this is exactly why I posted this here, I can't wrap my head around all the information that's being spewed forth from the astrologists and the conspiracy theorists. I'm going to go on a limb here and say the names you listed such as Haumea are dwarf planets? I know Eris is at least. And yes, it's ring goes out quite far beyond Pluto, but according to Mr. Zecharia the Sumerian name Nibiru means "to cross". In other words, it crosses between orbital rings and winds up shooting itself into the realm of the rocky planets. This is where I get skeptical because something of that size would most likely collide with another planet or at least get flung out by Jupiter itself.. But men who claim the impossible are proven wrong many times, so I don't want to dismiss it without having a full understanding of just how strong gravitational pulls may effect an object of that size traveling through our solar system.

And I never said Red Giant. I know how big those are, and I agree, nothing of that size could ever possibly have an orbit like that. It would probably gobble up the Sun lol. I said Red Dwarf. It's pretty much an unborn sun, too small to have ever ignited but it's still almost there..
:Edit: My mistake, seems like I said Red Dwarf lol. I'm sorry, I meant Brown Dwarf. Sorry for the mix-up. n_n;

That's also some very interesting information, thank you for putting that up.

As for Tiamat.. According to what I've read, Earth was Tiamat before being struck by another planet, in which the debris made our current Earth, the Moon, and the asteroid belt. If you're telling me that Tiamat was the rogue planet that hit Earth, then alright, I can go for that. :P
Nothing in the world is impossible.
Get up, what you slowin' down for?
User avatar
Joehtosis
Genestealer
 
Posts: 151
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:57 am
Location: Delaware

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Zaha on Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:10 pm

I'm going to go on a limb here and say the names you listed such as Haumea are dwarf planets?
Haumea and Makemake are Kuiper Belt Objects large enough to class as dwarf planets (and larger than Pluto to boot if memory serves) and Eris exists beyond the Kuiper belt.

My mistake, seems like I said Red Dwarf lol. I'm sorry, I meant Brown Dwarf. Sorry for the mix-up. n_n;
My bad for getting mixed up too.

Brown dwarfs are probably still fairly unlikely. If they go anywhere near any other planet, that planet is gone.

As for Tiamat.. According to what I've read, Earth was Tiamat before being struck by another planet, in which the debris made our current Earth, the Moon, and the asteroid belt. If you're telling me that Tiamat was the rogue planet that hit Earth, then alright, I can go for that.
Tiamat is fairly clearly neither, being formless, fluid and pre-universal. That's a very, very liberal way of reading the story of Marduk slaying Tiamat to come to that sort of a rationale. And given that Tiamat/Tehom is such a damn accurate way of describing proto-/pre-universal chaos, it seems a rather... pitiful second place to posit Tiamat as a mere planet that gets run into by another.

Then again, given that Sitchin equates the Anunnaki with the Nephilim (Badbadbadbadbad! Elohim maybe, but Nephilim?! That's like equating demons and fae!), it's hardly surprising that he did that. :P
I am the Border of Kaleidoscopic Logic
User avatar
Zaha
Site Admin
Site Admin
 
Posts: 2078
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 9:20 am

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Joey625 on Wed Jul 01, 2009 10:43 pm

ok i am officially confused on the situation that is going on here o.o someone care to explain
My Dawn of War username is Joey62591 if anyone wants to hit me up for a game
Joey625
Broodlord
 
Posts: 266
Joined: Tue Jul 29, 2008 1:52 am
Location: Syracuse, NY

Re: Conspiracy...

Postby Joehtosis on Thu Jul 02, 2009 12:28 am

Alright, glad that's cleared up lol.

This story of Marduk sounds fairly interesting... I've heard the general summaries that it's essentially the precursor of the Bible and I dropped it thinking that was that.. I suppose that was rather ignorant of me. =P I only know general knowledge on Sumerian culture.. I think I'm gonna start reading up on them tonight.

Joe, (gonna be awkward having the same name lmao)
If you're really lost and interested enough, just try reading what I posted a couple more times through. I tried explaining to the best of my ability the main bulk of the Nibiru collision theory. It's a broad subject though, as you can see, so I suggest reading up a bit on astrology, some of the links I posted, and Sumerian culture (which is something I need to do =] ).
Nothing in the world is impossible.
Get up, what you slowin' down for?
User avatar
Joehtosis
Genestealer
 
Posts: 151
Joined: Tue Jun 23, 2009 9:57 am
Location: Delaware

Next

Return to Chat

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest

cron